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	<title>Comments on: Critical thinking, evolution, and how to not be dismissed as a total idiot</title>
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	<description>... because I don&#039;t watch enough hockey, drink enough beer, or eat enough bacon.</description>
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		<title>By: jthibeault</title>
		<link>http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171&#038;cpage=1#comment-305</link>
		<dc:creator>jthibeault</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Sep 2008 21:54:06 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>That&#039;s hilarious.  I did some googling myself and saw that apparently she got it done on Miami Ink -- meaning there&#039;s gotta be video out there somewhere.  Go forth and obtain this video, my minions!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s hilarious.  I did some googling myself and saw that apparently she got it done on Miami Ink &#8212; meaning there&#8217;s gotta be video out there somewhere.  Go forth and obtain this video, my minions!</p>
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		<title>By: Miranda</title>
		<link>http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171&#038;cpage=1#comment-304</link>
		<dc:creator>Miranda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Sep 2008 18:17:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171#comment-304</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m surprised at you Jason, all of that and not one comment about the lady with the grilled cheese tattooed on her chest? lol.
http://www.slashfood.com/2006/06/06/woman-gets-virgin-mary-grilled-cheese-tattoo/

While I have been unable to find a link that shows the actual tattoo, that link provides the story.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m surprised at you Jason, all of that and not one comment about the lady with the grilled cheese tattooed on her chest? lol.<br />
<a href="http://www.slashfood.com/2006/06/06/woman-gets-virgin-mary-grilled-cheese-tattoo/" rel="nofollow">http://www.slashfood.com/2006/06/06/woman-gets-virgin-mary-grilled-cheese-tattoo/</a></p>
<p>While I have been unable to find a link that shows the actual tattoo, that link provides the story.</p>
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		<title>By: jthibeault</title>
		<link>http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171&#038;cpage=1#comment-303</link>
		<dc:creator>jthibeault</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Sep 2008 16:27:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171#comment-303</guid>
		<description>Oh, Miranda, that&#039;s why I wrote it... I&#039;m inviting debate.  Please disagree with me!  Even if you&#039;ll likely never really convince me that I&#039;m wrong, debating with me helps me sharpen and focus my own arguments.  And besides, that way I get to know more about how you think, which is important to me in knowing and understanding those people I call my friends.  It&#039;s also primarily why I tolerate Bob.  ;)

I do feel there is some critical thinking ability left in this world, if only because I exist.  If someone like me, with all my foibles, is capable of the feat, then someone else out there likely is too.  Besides, look at all those links I collected in that post.  There&#039;s a lot of really interesting and, dare I say it, CORRECT, analysis out there.  You just have to sift through the chaff to get it.  The same with politics -- there are honest politicians out there.  They&#039;re mostly the ones with the least experience in politics, though.  (And Bernie Sanders.)

I&#039;m saving most of my LHC discussions for an upcoming post wherein I tear apart not only my friend and coworker as mentioned in this thread, but also &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=175&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;the troll mentioned in my most recent post&lt;/a&gt;.   Sorry, but there&#039;s enough &quot;there&quot; there, that I have to try to play this close to my chest.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, Miranda, that&#8217;s why I wrote it&#8230; I&#8217;m inviting debate.  Please disagree with me!  Even if you&#8217;ll likely never really convince me that I&#8217;m wrong, debating with me helps me sharpen and focus my own arguments.  And besides, that way I get to know more about how you think, which is important to me in knowing and understanding those people I call my friends.  It&#8217;s also primarily why I tolerate Bob.  <img src='http://www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>I do feel there is some critical thinking ability left in this world, if only because I exist.  If someone like me, with all my foibles, is capable of the feat, then someone else out there likely is too.  Besides, look at all those links I collected in that post.  There&#8217;s a lot of really interesting and, dare I say it, CORRECT, analysis out there.  You just have to sift through the chaff to get it.  The same with politics &#8212; there are honest politicians out there.  They&#8217;re mostly the ones with the least experience in politics, though.  (And Bernie Sanders.)</p>
<p>I&#8217;m saving most of my LHC discussions for an upcoming post wherein I tear apart not only my friend and coworker as mentioned in this thread, but also <a href="http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=175" rel="nofollow">the troll mentioned in my most recent post</a>.   Sorry, but there&#8217;s enough &#8220;there&#8221; there, that I have to try to play this close to my chest.</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-303" src="http://www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('303', 'add', 'www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Like" /> <span id="karma-303-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-303" src="http://www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('303', 'subtract', 'www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Dislike" /> <span id="karma-303-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span> (<span id="karma-303-total" >0</span>)</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Miranda</title>
		<link>http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171&#038;cpage=1#comment-302</link>
		<dc:creator>Miranda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Sep 2008 13:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171#comment-302</guid>
		<description>Firstly, I&#039;m not going to get into my opinions on the above rantings, lets just say I disagree with some things that were said and leave it at that, I don&#039;t like trying to argue my points online like this, chances are something will get misunderstood or I will simply misrepresent myself because I am not as verbose or well written as I would like to be and simply lack the methods to accurately get my poitns across.

So on to something I thought was damn funny. Speaking of the imagines of divine figures appearing on bread. Do you remember the lady who sold her grilled cheese sandwhich with the image of the virgin mary on it to a casino for a ridiculas amount of money? Well, I was watching Miami Ink one night and guess who should walk into the tatto shop by the grilled cheese lady. To get a tattoo of her virgin  mary grilled cheese sandwhich. I kid you not, she got a tatoo of the sandwhich, complete with the one bite she took out of it, on her chest, just above her heart. I&#039;m all for letting people believe what they want, even if I happen to find that belief silly, but I have to admit I laughed a lot when I saw her getting a tatto of a grilled cheese sandwhich.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Firstly, I&#8217;m not going to get into my opinions on the above rantings, lets just say I disagree with some things that were said and leave it at that, I don&#8217;t like trying to argue my points online like this, chances are something will get misunderstood or I will simply misrepresent myself because I am not as verbose or well written as I would like to be and simply lack the methods to accurately get my poitns across.</p>
<p>So on to something I thought was damn funny. Speaking of the imagines of divine figures appearing on bread. Do you remember the lady who sold her grilled cheese sandwhich with the image of the virgin mary on it to a casino for a ridiculas amount of money? Well, I was watching Miami Ink one night and guess who should walk into the tatto shop by the grilled cheese lady. To get a tattoo of her virgin  mary grilled cheese sandwhich. I kid you not, she got a tatoo of the sandwhich, complete with the one bite she took out of it, on her chest, just above her heart. I&#8217;m all for letting people believe what they want, even if I happen to find that belief silly, but I have to admit I laughed a lot when I saw her getting a tatto of a grilled cheese sandwhich.</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-302" src="http://www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('302', 'add', 'www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Like" /> <span id="karma-302-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-302" src="http://www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('302', 'subtract', 'www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Dislike" /> <span id="karma-302-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span> (<span id="karma-302-total" >0</span>)</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Me</title>
		<link>http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171&#038;cpage=1#comment-301</link>
		<dc:creator>Me</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Sep 2008 18:53:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171#comment-301</guid>
		<description>Thank you. Very well written. And I also thank you for pointing out that while you and I disagree on things we do so in a rational way without resulting to name calling (except in the case of Clifton). Thank you also for pointing out that being skeptical (with a valid and logical point to your skepticism) is a good thing rather then a bad thing. Lately being a skeptic in anything has been seen as a negative, to the point where some people have actually suggested the governments of the world make it illegal to be skeptical of some things. Who knows what inevitable cesspit that particular little bit of legislation would have led us all into. 

I do have one question for you. Given the world we live in, and indeed where you work, what makes you believe that there is any such thing as critical thinking left in the world, outside of a few small independent science labs? There is far more evidence to suggest that we as a race are becoming dumber not smarter. And I point to this article (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/leading_article/article4735469.ece) to underscore my point that some are indeed becoming dumber and the media is printing their words. Yes the article argues against what the good Rev Professor Michael Reiss, a Royal Society scientist no less, says but this man is a member of the Royal society in the UK and that carries with it some prestige. Printing his words gives him validity no matter if he is right or wrong. And if you know that someone was drunk when they saw a UFO, why would you even mention that you know someone that saw a UFO. (I know that&#039;s a stretch as an analogy, but seriously, when it comes to arguing against science in a science class, drunks seeing UFOs are an apt analogy.)


I would like to abuse the term theory for a moment here and I apologize for what I&#039;m about to do but I feel that it will underline nicely your points about people misusing the word. Currently there is a *theory* in schools that all students should learn at the same speed and level. In the US they call this &quot;no child left behind&quot;. I saw the beginnings of this in the early 90&#039;s when parents began to complain to teachers that their child wasn&#039;t being allowed to do the same things as other students were. How has no one, not even parents realized how horrible a *theory* this is. You are forcing all students to learn at the level of the slowest student. I don&#039;t have the time to expound on how bad this is going to turn out. 

In the business world, well the only way I can even come close to describing the stupidity rampant here is to point out that Managers have taken to calling themselves leaders yet have no idea what it is the people they are leading even do. &#039;Nuff said about that. 

As for the loss of critical thinking in other areas, well I&#039;m not actually sure it even existed in politics. Government leaders are suddenly spouting more and more religious sentiments in their speeches and invoking the name of god. Has no one in any of the various departments that provide support to these talking heads reminded them of history? Countries are not made up of people who all believe the same thing. You are invariably pissing off someone in your own country when you speak of god, simply because it won&#039;t be *their* god. Pissing off people over god is a sure way to get civil strive. I point to Northern Ireland as my proof of two religious groups that even speak the same language and yet can&#039;t get along. 

And in western society as a whole there is the all pervading believe in the last 25 years that the world governments owe the people a living. People have come to believe that they are entitled to a good life and that it&#039;s up to governments to provide it somehow.

Critical thinking has been eradicated in our society the same as common sense, accepting responsibility for our own actions, and providing for ourselves. People now accept only ideas that are in the consensus of the population (which is why I particularly hate that word. A consensus is a bad reason to accept anything as fact). They believe their ideas even when they fly in the face of logic and facts. I admit that in some areas I too believe only on faith but that is because I haven&#039;t yet seen the facts I need to see to change my beliefs. That doesn&#039;t mean I&#039;m right and I am certainly open to changing my beliefs if the evidence conclusively proves me wrong. Sadly I am a rarity in today&#039;s&#039; society, someone open to changing my way of thinking. The majority of people believe in things that can&#039;t be supported by any sort of facts at all and I doubt that even if you were to show them conclusive proof of something they would still call you a liar and tell you how wrong you are. (flat earthers, people that believe the moon landings were a hoax, and ANYONE that believes a political promise)That&#039;s because we have lost the ability to reason logically. 

I am exited about the LHC and what it might or might not find. I think this is a step in the right direction because I have always maintained that no matter how you believe the universe came to exist it required a leap of faith of some sort as there is no proof of anything. Some say the big bang and some say creation. Who knows? I certainly don&#039;t. What I do know is that right now my biggest fear is that the LHC will find nothing at all or even worse experience some sort of accident. This will give the creationists the ammunition they need to shut it down and push us into the dark ages once again. If that happens we can all forget about even hoping that critical thinking will ever become the norm again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you. Very well written. And I also thank you for pointing out that while you and I disagree on things we do so in a rational way without resulting to name calling (except in the case of Clifton). Thank you also for pointing out that being skeptical (with a valid and logical point to your skepticism) is a good thing rather then a bad thing. Lately being a skeptic in anything has been seen as a negative, to the point where some people have actually suggested the governments of the world make it illegal to be skeptical of some things. Who knows what inevitable cesspit that particular little bit of legislation would have led us all into. </p>
<p>I do have one question for you. Given the world we live in, and indeed where you work, what makes you believe that there is any such thing as critical thinking left in the world, outside of a few small independent science labs? There is far more evidence to suggest that we as a race are becoming dumber not smarter. And I point to this article (<a href="http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/leading_article/article4735469.ece" rel="nofollow">http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/leading_article/article4735469.ece</a>) to underscore my point that some are indeed becoming dumber and the media is printing their words. Yes the article argues against what the good Rev Professor Michael Reiss, a Royal Society scientist no less, says but this man is a member of the Royal society in the UK and that carries with it some prestige. Printing his words gives him validity no matter if he is right or wrong. And if you know that someone was drunk when they saw a UFO, why would you even mention that you know someone that saw a UFO. (I know that&#8217;s a stretch as an analogy, but seriously, when it comes to arguing against science in a science class, drunks seeing UFOs are an apt analogy.)</p>
<p>I would like to abuse the term theory for a moment here and I apologize for what I&#8217;m about to do but I feel that it will underline nicely your points about people misusing the word. Currently there is a *theory* in schools that all students should learn at the same speed and level. In the US they call this &#8220;no child left behind&#8221;. I saw the beginnings of this in the early 90&#8242;s when parents began to complain to teachers that their child wasn&#8217;t being allowed to do the same things as other students were. How has no one, not even parents realized how horrible a *theory* this is. You are forcing all students to learn at the level of the slowest student. I don&#8217;t have the time to expound on how bad this is going to turn out. </p>
<p>In the business world, well the only way I can even come close to describing the stupidity rampant here is to point out that Managers have taken to calling themselves leaders yet have no idea what it is the people they are leading even do. &#8216;Nuff said about that. </p>
<p>As for the loss of critical thinking in other areas, well I&#8217;m not actually sure it even existed in politics. Government leaders are suddenly spouting more and more religious sentiments in their speeches and invoking the name of god. Has no one in any of the various departments that provide support to these talking heads reminded them of history? Countries are not made up of people who all believe the same thing. You are invariably pissing off someone in your own country when you speak of god, simply because it won&#8217;t be *their* god. Pissing off people over god is a sure way to get civil strive. I point to Northern Ireland as my proof of two religious groups that even speak the same language and yet can&#8217;t get along. </p>
<p>And in western society as a whole there is the all pervading believe in the last 25 years that the world governments owe the people a living. People have come to believe that they are entitled to a good life and that it&#8217;s up to governments to provide it somehow.</p>
<p>Critical thinking has been eradicated in our society the same as common sense, accepting responsibility for our own actions, and providing for ourselves. People now accept only ideas that are in the consensus of the population (which is why I particularly hate that word. A consensus is a bad reason to accept anything as fact). They believe their ideas even when they fly in the face of logic and facts. I admit that in some areas I too believe only on faith but that is because I haven&#8217;t yet seen the facts I need to see to change my beliefs. That doesn&#8217;t mean I&#8217;m right and I am certainly open to changing my beliefs if the evidence conclusively proves me wrong. Sadly I am a rarity in today&#8217;s&#8217; society, someone open to changing my way of thinking. The majority of people believe in things that can&#8217;t be supported by any sort of facts at all and I doubt that even if you were to show them conclusive proof of something they would still call you a liar and tell you how wrong you are. (flat earthers, people that believe the moon landings were a hoax, and ANYONE that believes a political promise)That&#8217;s because we have lost the ability to reason logically. </p>
<p>I am exited about the LHC and what it might or might not find. I think this is a step in the right direction because I have always maintained that no matter how you believe the universe came to exist it required a leap of faith of some sort as there is no proof of anything. Some say the big bang and some say creation. Who knows? I certainly don&#8217;t. What I do know is that right now my biggest fear is that the LHC will find nothing at all or even worse experience some sort of accident. This will give the creationists the ammunition they need to shut it down and push us into the dark ages once again. If that happens we can all forget about even hoping that critical thinking will ever become the norm again.</p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-301" src="http://www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('301', 'add', 'www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Like" /> <span id="karma-301-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-301" src="http://www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('301', 'subtract', 'www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Dislike" /> <span id="karma-301-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span> (<span id="karma-301-total" >0</span>)</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Jodi</title>
		<link>http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171&#038;cpage=1#comment-300</link>
		<dc:creator>Jodi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Sep 2008 01:48:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.lousycanuck.ca/?p=171#comment-300</guid>
		<description>lolz at the black hole link :P</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>lolz at the black hole link <img src='http://www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_razz.gif' alt=':P' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p> <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-300" src="http://www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('300', 'add', 'www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" title="Like" /> <span id="karma-300-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-300" src="http://www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('300', 'subtract', 'www.lousycanuck.ca/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" title="Dislike" /> <span id="karma-300-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span> (<span id="karma-300-total" >0</span>)</p>]]></content:encoded>
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